NOT breaking in a 2T engine correctly

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:20 pm

So after 30 miles in 2 days of running around back roads and pulling steep hills at WOT almost constantly, I now hear of this "1/2/ throttle break in".
What???
1/2 throttle for the first 300 miles?
That is impossible to do where I live unless I get my azz run over by local
traffic! LOL

So it is full throttle "ride it like I stole it" for me.

I sell brand new Husqvarna chainsaws, my most popular model has a
72cc engine (sad, the chainsaw engine is BIGGER than my scooter!)
and there is NO "break in period" for those!
They go straight from here to the sawmill / logging company and get the t-total crap run out if them!!!

And hold up just fine and dandy.

So is the Genuine 2T engine just a total piece of crap that Genuine is scared of then? What gives?

This just sounded like too much of an internet myth to me,,,,,,,,,,,,
but then I (finally) read the owners manual, and it is in there too!!!
this is bull !!!

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 3:32 pm

Well, it is your scooter so I suppose you do whatever you want. I certainly would not ride a new scooter at WOT constantly for the first 300 miles. I also would not ride it at 1/2 throttle for 300 miles. I would vary the engine RPMs while riding so that the engine experienced a range of break-in conditions. I have broken in over a dozen new bikes that way with good success.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 4:11 pm

Not trying to be a wet blanket, but if you find it 'sad' that your chainsaw has a bigger engine than your scooter, maybe you should have purchased differently.

A 50cc scoot has plenty of uses, but if you MUST run it WOT all the time, again, I would venture to say you might have made the wrong choice.

I bet if you just maintain it correctly it will be fine though. They're pretty tough machines.

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 6:31 pm

Well, there is a whole school of thought that says, "Forget the Break-In Period. Ride it like you stole it from day one." Some of them have impressive good results. So maybe that's how your story will go. If not, the worst possible thing that can happen is a new jug/piston/ring set and you get a Mulligan on the Break-In. It is my fond hope that both roads eventually lead to RH 50 happiness!

Also, Welcome to Modern Buddy since I seem to have missed the opportunity to welcome you previously.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 7:45 pm

If you want a bigger engine you can always go this route.

http://www.scooterworks.com/prima-cylin ... NkO2tEtHzA

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:26 am

Break in is one of those issues that I generally don't argue, but I will say what I do.

It depends on the motor. In general I take it pretty easy for the first 300 miles. On CBR 2012 I seized my top end and replaced. I took it kinda easy for the first 100 miles and then hammered the snot out of it...but that was the CBR and that motor needs a full tear down.

With my P200 modified to 225 cc with a pinasco kit and stroker crank I'm in the middle of an 800 mile break in. Why so many miles?

First it is a Nisil lined cylinder...very very hard. Al at Hot Rod Scooters modified the head and did the porting and gave me the break in schedule.The first 300 were half to 3/4 throttle, varying RPMs. After 300 miles rev it out in each gear with moderate throttle. After that rev it out hard in each gear.

Most people focus on the top end and setting the rings during break in but remember...all the parts are new.

With my motor I am taking into account crank stretch and all the new high quality bearings. Yup...bearings need to be broken in too.

As Al says...break it in like a dog...it will run like a dog...break it in right...it will run right.

I know there are many that will disagree. The main argument I hear for "hard" break in is based on one obscure web page that has no supporting information.

In the end what ever the owner decides to do is their business. I just know what I do has been very successful.

MYSCTR · Post by **MYSCTR** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:38 am

Good disclaimer for any warranty work that may come up isn't it?

After we picked up my wife's third and finally brand new Buddy, we had a couple of hundred miles on it and our local shop said no worries ride it the way you intend on riding it meaning forget the break in. My concern was we were headed on a very long day looking at about 200 miles and quite a bit at speeds beyond what is suggested in the owners manual. She now has well over 15,000 miles and had no trouble.

We would suggest changing your 'break in' oil quicker and maybe gear oil, yet ride it like you intend on riding it. Maybe even do a secondary oil change just to insure any metal fragments are out by the time you hit 300-400 miles.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:50 am

COYOTE102076 wrote: So it is full throttle "ride it like I stole it" for me.

I sell brand new Husqvarna chainsaws, my most popular model has a
72cc engine (sad, the chainsaw engine is BIGGER than my scooter!)
and there is NO "break in period" for those!
They go straight from here to the sawmill / logging company and get the t-total crap run out if them!!! And hold up just fine and dandy.

So is the Genuine 2T engine just a total piece of crap that Genuine is scared of then? What gives?

This just sounded like too much of an internet myth to me,,,,,,,,,,,,
but then I (finally) read the owners manual, and it is in there too!!!
this is bull !!!

No...Genuine's 50 cc motors are not crap. They are of the same general quality as Honda, Kymco, SYM etc.

Your scooter is not a chainsaw. Husqvarna also makes motorcycles. Nice bikes by the way. They do not suggest breaking them in like a chainsaw.

From the Husky motorcycle owners manual

"Before using the motorcycle for sporting activities run in the engine for two hours at least to increase the life and performance of the engine.
During the first half-hour of driving we advise keeping a low speed and avoiding sudden accelerations. Never open the throttle fully.
Change the oil and carry out all the necessary maintenance operations. After the first half-hour of driving, lightly increase the rev number, but never run the engine at full throttle. Never keep low speeds when the gears are inserted.

Following a rebuild

Before your first engine start-up, you must follow the procedure below:
Step 1: Pre-lube cylinder w/ thin layer of engine oil before installing head.
Then tighten all head studs to 22-24 Ft-lbs.

Step 2: Wait 15 minutes, do not start engine, and then re-tighten studs to the same 22-24 Ft-lbs.
Why? Because the pressure will stretch the head studs and the new gasket(s) will flatten.

Step 3: Start engine, let idle for 5 minutes, then go for a 30 minute ride at no more than 1/2 throttle.

Step 4: Once engine is cool, re-tighten head studs again to the same 22-24 Ft-lbs, change transmission oil,
check clutch cable adjustment, and change the spark plug to finish the break-in process.

Again...it is your scooter and your choice. I would however suggest reading the sections of the manual pertaining to maintenance fairly soon.

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:34 am

Buddy in your reply in regards to the Husqvarna motorcycle, notice is says "2 hours".
I can see, even on a scooter, having a 2 to 4 hour break in.
But 300 miles is a bit ridiculous.
I mean seriously think about this. 1/2 to 3/4 throttle on a scooter
that UNrestricted only tops out at 45 50 speedo indicated MPH.
Just for kicks I just went out and after a 3 min warm up rode the scoot
in this balmy warm high 30's temp we are having this evening and went at 1/2 throttle on the flat parts of our small subdivision. Yielded about 20 MPH. So I went out on the main road. Now we are at the dead bottom of 2 long large steep hills. When you leave our road, left or right, it is a solid 1/4 mile 6% grade either direction. 3/4 throttle barely made it to 15 MPH.
On a road that has a posted speed limit of 55.

I was keeping a constant eye in the rear view mirror and had my hazard flashers on.
Since the RH50 was a derestricted demo unit with 8X miles on it when I got it, I have no way of knowing what those first miles were like, but being a demo I would imaging them all being mostly WOT! LOL
--- shrugs ---

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:52 am

I see that you have made up your mind. May I just suggest that you make sure your tires are scrubbed in before hitting the turns hard. Yes tires also need to be broken in..as well as wheel bearings, brakes etc, etc

Seriously...I build motors. Seriously...I'm doing an 800 mile break in

My BMW 650 required...300 miles, vary RPM 1/2 to 3/4 throttle max keep it under 50 mph for break in.

Seriously...it's a 50 cc motor...what did you expect from it? A 50 cc meets many peoples needs just fine, perhaps it is not the right scooter for you.

You asked a question, you got some good answers

Believe whatever you want to and ignore the owners manual if you choose to. Treat it like a chain saw if you desire to, personally...I don't care. It's your scooter.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 3:31 am

"Treat it like a chainsaw....." That cracked me up Buddy......

skipper20 · Post by **skipper20** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 3:41 pm

COYOTE102076 wrote:Buddy in your reply in regards to the Husqvarna motorcycle, notice is says "2 hours".
I can see, even on a scooter, having a 2 to 4 hour break in.
But 300 miles is a bit ridiculous.
I mean seriously think about this. 1/2 to 3/4 throttle on a scooter
that UNrestricted only tops out at 45 50 speedo indicated MPH.
Just for kicks I just went out and after a 3 min warm up rode the scoot
in this balmy warm high 30's temp we are having this evening and went at 1/2 throttle on the flat parts of our small subdivision. Yielded about 20 MPH. So I went out on the main road. Now we are at the dead bottom of 2 long large steep hills. When you leave our road, left or right, it is a solid 1/4 mile 6% grade either direction. 3/4 throttle barely made it to 15 MPH.
On a road that has a posted speed limit of 55.
I was keeping a constant eye in the rear view mirror and had my hazard flashers on.
Since the RH50 was a derestricted demo unit with 8X miles on it when I got it, I have no way of knowing what those first miles were like, but being a demo I would imaging them all being mostly WOT! LOL
--- shrugs ---

Your comments confirm in my mind that your 50cc scoot just isn't up to your local hilly terrain with its 6% grades and 55mph speed limits. Stop worrying about break-in and start thinking about trading in that RH50 for something in the 125-150cc range that can keep up with your local traffic. Seriously.

Bill in Seattle but currently wintering in Tucson
'09 150 Blackjack
'12 170i Italia (AZ scoot)

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:31 pm

I agree with Skipper. Get a 125/150. Too bad they don't make the Rattler anymore! Coyote, the Rattler was a Roughouse with a 110cc 2 stroke engine., BTW. Cool bike that could be tricked out to be a screamer.

You need a bigger bike Coyote. After I got my first scooter(50cc), I started looking for a bigger one very shortly. Genuine scooters are of great quality so if you stay with the brand you can't go wrong.

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:57 pm

I appreciate good answers.
I do not appreciate mockery.

This was never a question of "making up my mind".

Had you paid any attention to the FIRST post you would have read
" So it is full throttle "ride it like I stole it" for me. "

This was nothing more than me expressing my disagreement.
Oh, and by the way, I too have built motors. To the tune of
a 800 HP biturbo Cummins diesel. That was just one of more than I care
to count that I have built.
Never have I ever come across a 300+ mile break in period before.

One thing is made clear from this post, I now know who on here is the sarcastic ones, and who is a straight shooter.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:05 pm

COYOTE102076 wrote:I appreciate good answers.
I do not appreciate mockery.

This was never a question of "making up my mind".

Had you paid any attention to the FIRST post you would have read
" So it is full throttle "ride it like I stole it" for me. "

This was nothing more than me expressing my disagreement.
Oh, and by the way, I too have built motors. To the tune of
a 800 HP biturbo Cummins diesel. That was just one of more than I care
to count that I have built.
Never have I ever come across a 300+ mile break in period before.

One thing is made clear from this post, I now know who on here is the sarcastic ones, and who is a straight shooter.

I can be both sarcastic and straight shooting!

I believe the mockery came from you not taking the advice given and instead questioning it. I completely understand where you are coming from. All forums have different vibes and codes of conduct. As has been explained to me(I have ruffled feathers before), it's like walking into a local bar for the first time. It's best to listen awhile before you start telling people what's what, LOL. I have enjoyed trying to answer your questions and hope you stick around. I assure you even the member(s) that have rubbed you wrong mean the very best. This is a community and sometimes shit happens. Welcome!!!!

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:35 pm

As Coyote has explained so clearly, he was not looking for advice and is not interested in advice. As he said - "So it is full throttle ride it like I stole it for me". Presumably he is also not interested in a discussion of different views. That begs the question of what he does hope to get from this site. Krispy's analogy to a bar was a good one.

lovemysan · Post by **lovemysan** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 6:36 pm

2-4 hours is ample breakin for normal riding. But I would wait a few hundred miles until I attempted to find the top speed. You probably didn't hurt anything. I've known lots of larger people that have 50cc bikes. Any type of hill on a 35mph road will have you running full throttle. It really doesn't seen to hurt them. On my 4 stroke builds I use a hard breakin when I do a big bore kit. I found the ring seal is best after a hard break in. Of course I'm not using a nikasil cylinder.

kmrcstintn · Post by **kmrcstintn** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 7:23 pm

COYOTE102076...

I'll share what happened with a low mileage used bike I got last year, a 2009 Suzuki GZ250 with less than 1400 miles on it; even though the bike was well beyond the '600 mile' break-in period according to the owners' manual I did several oil changes (4 oil changes & 2 filter changes in the next 2500 miles) and kept getting metal fragments in the bottom of the drain pan which tells me that the previous owner babied the hell out of it (the oil chage between 2900-3000 miles didn't have nearly as much metal); finally @ 3000 miles the engine felt as though it 'opened up' and my top end increased by about 10% to 15%...I have somewhere between 4500-5000 miles and still ride it conservatively

in the past 5 years I also owned 6 or 7 new scooters (Piaggio BV250, Aprilia Scarabeo 100, Vespa LX150, 2 different Genuine Buddy 125's, Genuine Rattler 2T, and Genuine Stella 2T) and found that conservative break-ins worked well for all of them; all the used motorcycles I have bought have been low mileage and treated them like I was still doing break-ins until they hit 5000-6000 miles on the odometer;

I finally settled down on my buy-sell-trade and plan on keeping my 2 bikes for several years while I fix my financial situation!

I truly hope that you don't need to rebuild the engine prematurely and that you get a good long service life out of your scooter!

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 9:36 pm

kmrcstintn wrote:............
I truly hope that you don't need to rebuild the engine prematurely and that you get a good long service life out of your scooter!

Well I guess that is kind of a mute point at the moment since I have already ordered the stage 2 70cc kit.
It is a matter of me never leaving well enough alone.

Maybe with the 70cc stage 2 kit I can break in at 3/4 throttle.
Maybe. We will see. Over in the RoughHouse section is a
thread already started on it, and all results will be posted
for other current and future owners of the RH50's reference.

My contribution to the Modern Buddy forum will be found in
that section. Since I can not find where someone has taken
a RH50 to it's near maximum potential.

I am still hunting for a different (numerically lower) final drive
gear set to bring the top end RPM's down a bit.
I see gobs listed on the internet for the GY6, but nothing for
the Genuine 50cc rigs. :-/ Unless I am just missing the
forest for the trees there.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:22 pm

Honestly...I'm not trying to give you a hard time but comparisons to chain saws and diesel engines just don't make any sense.

Again..it's your scooter, you have the owner's manual, it is not the only PTW for which a break in of 300 miles is suggested.

Making statements like the suggested break in is "bull" and asking if Genuine's products are "crap" does suggest that you have arrived at a conclusion before reviewing actual facts.

Just a reminder that if you kit the top end break in starts all over again for it. I'm not sure how putting on a new top end kit allows 3/4 throttle for break in. If you do slap a kit on it let us know. Some here will have suggestions for compatible exhausts and jetting.

Let's take a look at the facts. Your scooter has already been run hard and lugged up hills. Basically a very hard break in has been completed. Is that good or bad? Please let us know how it holds up.

On the good side, since you are familiar with motors a 50cc 2T rebuild isn't that bad a job to do.

My apologies if you took offense, again..it is your scooter...do what you want to with it...I don't care.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:31 pm

I've done both types of break in on bikes. Sometimes even for the full 1200 miles some bike manufacturers recommend. Honestly? A mixed break in seems to work the best. Vary throttle, speed, keep the engine under load... Change the oil and adjust the valves when you are suposeded to… and occasionally open it up all the way for a few seconds (or when it tops out).

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:23 am

Stitch wrote:I've done both types of break in on bikes. Sometimes even for the full 1200 miles some bike manufacturers recommend. Honestly? A mixed break in seems to work the best. Vary throttle, speed, keep the engine under load... Change the oil and adjust the valves when you are suposeded to… and occasionally open it up all the way for a few seconds (or when it tops out).

DAMMITT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THIS IS HOW TO DO IT!!!!!!

Start clean(oils) run it WOT then bring it down.

The big thing is to rev it to the limit and bounce down and chill out.

Edit-This is when you want to flush fluids.

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:43 am

"Change oil"
"Adjust valves"
this is a 2 stroker!

Having that been said, I do need to swap the rear gear oil out with Amsoil.
The Amsoil sticker is good for 1 extra HP, right?

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:49 am

Lol. Now I wanna buy a roughhouse and break it in my way, and then dyno it.
Ya, that sounds like a plan.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:57 am

COYOTE102076 wrote:"Change oil"
"Adjust valves"
this is a 2 stroker!

Having that been said, I do need to swap the rear gear oil out with Amsoil.
The Amsoil sticker is good for 1 extra HP, right?

Shit the bed with that. Oh well.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:02 am

Seems to me this thread had a little bit more than just 2 strokes discussed. For that matter, no one even asked if it was a gas or diesel 2t

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:05 am

It depends where you put the sticker

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:09 am

Stitch wrote:Seems to me this thread had a little bit more than just 2 strokes discussed. For that matter, no one even asked if it was a gas or diesel 2t

That's because us savages don't like to huff diesel soot.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:14 am

Lol, it lacks the lasting flavor you get from following a pack of 2t's

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:17 am

Stitch wrote:Lol, it lacks the lasting flavor you get from following a pack of 2t's

You should try harder asshole.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:24 am

Stitch wrote:It depends where you put the sticker

Lube that sticker up buddy and attach it to your thumb.......play switch you

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:34 am

Mmmmmk. Not sure what that's all about. Have a nice night.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:45 am

Oh, for the record, my Stella is a 2t and covered with stickers. I also drive truck. I honestly have no idea what set you off.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:50 am

Stitch wrote:Oh, for the record, my Stella is a 2t and covered with stickers. I also drive truck. I honestly have no idea what set you off.

You use Motul.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:57 am

No, I use Spectro in the scooters.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 6:03 am

Stitch wrote:No, I use Spectro in the scooters.

Big mouth and big oil.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 6:15 am

No, they sell it in quart bottles

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Wed Feb 11, 2015 6:26 am

Cool ride.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 12:05 am

srbbnd · Post by **srbbnd** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:17 am

From Genuine's Website:

How do I break in my scooter?

There is a lot of debate on this topic, and a lot of chatter on the internet. When in doubt, ALWAYS refer to your owner's manual and talk to your authorized Genuine Scooter dealer. The manual was written by the engineers who designed and built your scooter. We'd say that carries more weight than some random guy with an internet connection.

Your manual goes into specifics, but here's a general overview:

The engine in your scooter was run and tested at the factory, but only briefly. So when you're breaking in your scooter, the internal parts of your engine are essentially rubbing together for the first time. The friction points between the various components need time to wear down to a smooth surface.

Among your engine internals, the most important parts to consider are the piston rings. If you break in your engine correctly, you'll create a nice tight fit between the piston rings and the cylinder wall. A tight fit is necessary to create a barrier that prevents oil from leaking into the combustion chamber. You need your oil to lubricate, not to burn!

The best way to break in a scooter is to do a lot of city riding, places where there are lots of stop signs and lots of stop-and-go traffic.

Why is that? As you accelerate your scooter, you're putting a load on the engine. When a load is put on the engine, the piston rings are forced outward, pushing them hard against the cylinder wall. As this happens, a nice, squared off edge forms on the rings. A squared off edge helps the piston ring do its job of creating an oil barrier.

The worst way to break in a scooter is to cruise on a highway, especially if it's at wide open throttle.

If you're cruising at the same speed, you're not putting enough load on the engine. As a result, the piston rings get a rounded edge, and will not be able to prevent oil from leaking into the combustion chamber. Your scooter will burn oil, it won't run very well, and you won't be very happy.

Once you've logged a few hundred miles, your scooter should be broken in. your manual says that you need a 500 mile first service. To be honest, 500 miles is the longest you'll want to wait for this service.

Here's why: All those engine parts rubbing together scrape off tiny shards of metal. These pieces float around in the oil, acting like sandpaper.

Replacing the oil filter and putting fresh oil in your engine therefore, is crucial to a long engine life.

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 2:04 pm

srbbnd wrote:..............
Here's why: All those engine parts rubbing together scrape off tiny shards of metal. These pieces float around in the oil, acting like sandpaper.

Replacing the oil filter and putting fresh oil in your engine therefore, is crucial to a long engine life.

This brings up a honest question in my mind.
Where do all the metal shavings go in a 2 stroke?
There is no oil to change.
there is no oil filter to change.
Do they just float around at the bottom of the crankcase till the
end of that motors life?
Or get blown out the exhaust?
I truly have no clue. I know on chainsaws I have broken down for
repair I sometimes find metal bits in the crankcase, however, this was usually on saws with a gaulded piston / sleeve

***Disclaimer: the following story has NOTHING to do with scooters or 2-stroke engines at all whatsoever. Read at your own boredom ***:

Looking at the quote above and laughing a little as I remember one
of the very first engines I rebuild about 24 years ago.
It was in my sisters Ford Tempo (remember those? lol ) and it had the
2.3L HSC motor. She ran it hot and blew the head gasket so while it was
in our shop we just rebuilt the entire motor. A "basic overhaul kit". Pistons, rings (30 over IIRC) , rod & mains (std), seals & gaskets. Had Earnest do the head work (now deceased). Put it back together and ran the engine for about 2 hours at 2000 RPM. Changed the oil and I STILL remember the oil almost looking like metallic dark brown paint.

Now I may be a little off, but seems to me like after a couple of tanks of fuel (600ish miles) we changed it again.
I can not say exactly how many miles she put on that car after that, but 3 years worth. And as far as "accelerate hard off & on" I am certain that part she done right because to this very day an "accelerator pedal" to my sister works the same way as a light switch!

Off, , , or ON. Almost nothing in between. Drives me NUTS!
When I rode with her one afternoon and she was driving her
old '94 Nissan 300ZX twin turbo in the rain it was,,,,,,,,,,,,,,interesting, to say the least!

kmrcstintn · Post by **kmrcstintn** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:06 pm

well...if yer keeping the 2T 50cc & rebuilding it then enjoy it!

hhmmm...Spectro; got 10 qts of their conventional 10w-40 oil ($5/qt clearance @ Cycle Gear) ready for both bikes this coming season; previously I've used Valvoline conventional 10w-40 when AutoZone would put their motorcycle oil on sale for $4/qt; HiFlo Filtro filters to boot...

srbbnd · Post by **srbbnd** » Fri Feb 13, 2015 3:39 am

Ford Tempo was my first car, it ended up in lake, had it towed out. Was up and running in a few weeks.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:24 pm

COYOTE102076 wrote: This brings up a honest question in my mind.
Where do all the metal shavings go in a 2 stroke?
There is no oil to change.
there is no oil filter to change.
Do they just float around at the bottom of the crankcase till the
end of that motors life?
Or get blown out the exhaust?
I truly have no clue. I know on chainsaws I have broken down for
repair I sometimes find metal bits in the crankcase, however, this was usually on saws with a gaulded piston / sleeve

Remember that a 2T works by the fuel and oil entering the crank case and then getting sucked up through the transfer ports to the cylinder. As you pointed out there are no valves so the ports are relatively enormous. So oil goes into the crankcase, lubes the bearings and cylinder, picks up and metal flakes, gets sucked up through the intake port then blown out through the exhaust port. Fresh oil is sucked on with each cycle.

If you look at 4T oil at it's first change there is some shiny metal in there but the flakes are tiny. If you snag a ring then you will get some big parts that can do damage. If you are doing a top end swap be sure that the ports are chamfered before assembly.

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 1:10 am

Sorry guys. The spirits took me over. Good thread.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:14 am

Gonna go snag a '15 RH (green and black) tomorrow, I'll start breaking it in as soon as the weather clears up. Gonna try to find a dyno nearby this summer and see what the numbers look like with a mixed break in. If someone get one done that had a hard break in, we will have some numbers to compare. Not exactly scientific, but it will give a general idea which makes more power.

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:27 am

BuddyRaton wrote: If you are doing a top end swap be sure that the ports are chamfered before assembly.

Funny you should mention that. Just this very night I was watching a
you tube vid on a guy who was doing exactly that!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8oCOIHI_G4

COYOTE102076 · Post by **COYOTE102076** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:38 am

Well Stich, had my overbore kit not just come in today, I would have been a great candidate for this comparison!!! :-/
Maybe someone else in here has given theirs a hard break in that has money to dyno one as well.
After tomorrow I may just leave mine alone for a while as is and we
can still compare them and I COULD just put all these parts on the shelf. But I don't think I could wait that long! lol
I go pick up my new 2015 Honda CBR300R in a few days, so my "top speed on road" issue is fixed. LOL

KrispyKreme · Post by **KrispyKreme** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:49 am

COYOTE102076 wrote:Well Stich, had my overbore kit not just come in today, I would have been a great candidate for this comparison!!! :-/
Maybe someone else in here has given theirs a hard break in that has money to dyno one as well.
After tomorrow I may just leave mine alone for a while as is and we
can still compare them and I COULD just put all these parts on the shelf. But I don't think I could wait that long! lol
I go pick up my new 2015 Honda CBR300R in a few days, so my "top speed on road" issue is fixed. LOL

You do not want advice on a break-in. You scoff at the idea.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:24 pm

COYOTE102076 wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote: If you are doing a top end swap be sure that the ports are chamfered before assembly.
Funny you should mention that. Just this very night I was watching a
you tube vid on a guy who was doing exactly that!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8oCOIHI_G4

In that video he is really opening up the ports and smoothing them out for flow. That's fine if you're porting out to match the cases.

No matter what you want to chamfer the ports inside the cylinder. Usually they are very sharp and can snag a ring.

You can use a dremel with a flex shaft but I usually just use a file...less chance of accidentally putting a gouge in the cylinder wall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFkpxW4xHhA

NOT breaking in a 2T engine correctly

NOT breaking in a 2T engine correctly

Re: NOT breaking in a 2T engine correctly