Stator Failure

Hudy_Gold · Post by **Hudy_Gold** » Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:37 pm

Hi MB,

I have owned my '09 Buddy 125 (bought new in 2011) for nearly 2 years and have put nearly 13,000 miles on it thus far with very few problems. I've worn out plenty of Zippy 1's but besides that she's been super reliable, fun, and fast scooter. Over the summer of 2012, I did run into the problem of having my stator go bad on me. This was covered by warranty and gave me a reason to get a few other service items taken care of. She ran perfectly after that for a few months, but I then started to experience sporadic idle problems where the engine would die while in idle. After adjusting the idle screw she ran fine. Well I went to take her for a ride the other day and she just didn't want to start. The starter cranked but the engine just wouldn't start. Had her towed to the shop only to find out that the stator has gone bad again! Thankfully she's still under warranty so I'm not out any money, however it does concern me that this has now happened twice within a year! Any ideas on what could be causing the stator to go bad? Are there any after market replacements that might be better quality than the replacements the shop is receiving from Genuine?

tortoise · Post by **tortoise** » Sun Mar 03, 2013 7:02 pm

Both the stator ignition coil winding and the trigger pickup coil are relatively easy to test . . volts . . Ohms . . trigger coil resource (replacement does not require flywheel removal).

scootERIK · Post by **scootERIK** » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:39 pm

scootERIK wrote:I recommend the the NCY stator over OEM, it was cheap and has lasted longer. The original stator in my '09 Buddy 125 last 4,800 miles, the generator part went out. I took it to the dealer and they put in a new one, and it lasted about 3,000 miles, the pickup part went bad. I found the NCY for $39.99 from the local shop(OEM costs $60.) I put it in myself, had to make a few custom tools. The NCY has 4,600+ miles on it and it is working good. The NCY is wired a little different, not a big deal but you have to get more wires behind the little holder so it is a little harder to install.

^ from this thread topic23813.html I now have 5,200 miles on it and still no problems. But if the dealer replaced it I wouldn't worry about it till it goes bad, just pay attention for the signs like dying when stop and hard starting.

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:53 pm

That may just be some bad luck. While there have been a few threads about stators going bad, most of us haven't had to worry about it.
I didn't need to replace mine until almost 32,000 miles. Some parts just eventually need replacing but having 2 go bad within the warranty period is out of the ordinary.
Fingers crossed that it was just a fluke!

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:58 pm

tortoise wrote:Both the stator ignition coil winding and the trigger pickup coil are relatively easy to test.

But beware, because the trigger pickup coil can be intermittent and it's extremely difficult to troubleshoot an intermittent electrical component.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:03 am

I think it's important to remember that some Buddys have been around for awhile now. Mine will be 7 years old this summer. Not unusual for "older" vehicles to start needing repairs other than maintenance.

It seems like stators and starters are prone to go after time.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:53 am

This one perplexes me. Are the solder joints on the wiring failing? Are the wires that make up the coil windings cracking, or shorting after rubbing their coating off? Insufficient potting? Stators may look daunting, but there isn't much to them. If anyone has info on what caused their stator to fail, I'm interested.

scootERIK · Post by **scootERIK** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:47 am

The two I had fail I believe failed in different ways the first was the generator part(?) and the second was the trigger part, at least that is what I think based on the symptoms.

More reading on stators-

topic9372.html

topic17901.html

topic2818.html

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:30 am

az_slynch wrote:This one perplexes me. Are the solder joints on the wiring failing? Are the wires that make up the coil windings cracking, or shorting after rubbing their coating off? Insufficient potting? Stators may look daunting, but there isn't much to them. If anyone has info on what caused their stator to fail, I'm interested.

The Buddy "stator assembly" has two parts, the actual stator that you're referring to and the ignition pickup coil. Usually, when folks around here say they their "stator" failed, they are referring to the ignition pickup coil. They replace the whole assembly because that's how it's sold. The reason I say this is that usually folks complain that their bike suddenly failed to start or (worse) suddenly stopped dead for no reason. Fairly commonly, the problem mysteriously goes away, then comes back, and so on.

If the actual stator failed, the scooter would still start/run but it would run its battery down slowly and that would be easy to diagnose. We don't hear that very often, but it does happen, as Erik points out above. Instead, what we hear more of is this sudden failure to start or the sudden stopping thing, which could be caused by a lot of common faults, like the spark plug wire falling off. But then the scooter will mysteriously start back up and run great for a while, and that makes troubleshooting difficult.

About the only way to troubleshoot intermittent electrics (other than getting lucky with a can of freeze spray) is to swap it out. Since the stator assy is a (relatively) inexpensive part that has a history of causing this problem, I've gotten in the habit of walking folks through the list of common things that cause sudden stopping and then suggest they swap out the stator assembly last. I hate doing that because it wastes time and money if I'm wrong (it happened again recently

), but nobody has come up with a better idea that I know of.

I see above that there is now a supply of the GY6-style ignition coil pickup units which can be swapped separately from the stator proper. Maybe that is the best solution. I guess it remains to be seen if they are a good fit and how reliable those replacement units are.

Again, if I'm wrong or if somebody has a better idea, I'd love to hear it. However, I've about come to the conclusion that ignition pickup coil failures are just the nature of the GY6 beast and that's maybe partly why Honda moved on from that design.

P.S. In my dreams, I've built a simple integrator circuit that parallels into the ignition pickup coil circuit with an SPDT switch so that you just flip the switch from "Run" to "Test Ignition Pickup Coil," kick the motor over, and get a GO or a NO-GO call on the ignition pickup coil right away, but that's a pipe dream for now. Want to help me design, prototype, and manufacture something like that? Nobody else does, either...

Sorry for the windy post, but you did ask.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:27 pm

Yes, yes I did.

Good knowledge, though. Forgive my incredulity; I've worked on bunches of older scooters and the only stator issues I'd ever come across were rotten wires and a loose spade terminal on the ignition coil.

Kinda silly to sell the stator plate and trigger coil as a set only!

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:15 pm

az_slynch wrote:Yes, yes I did.

Good knowledge, though. Forgive my incredulity; I've worked on bunches of older scooters and the only stator issues I'd ever come across were rotten wires and a loose spade terminal on the ignition coil.

Kinda silly to sell the stator plate and trigger coil as a set only!

The whole thing drives me crazy. I totally feel these people's pain when they have an intermittent one. Read this guy's story for example... I've linked Page 9. Read over to Page 11 for the exciting conclusion. Hint: he Kept Calm and Swapped the Stator. On the Road. To Alaska.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:22 pm

jrsjr wrote:Read this guy's story for example... I've linked Page 9. Read over to Page 11 for the exciting conclusion. Hint: He Kept Calm and Swapped the Stator. On the Road. To Alaska.

I've read that thread and enjoyed it! Other than ignition woes, sounded like a great trip. I need to save up some vacation time, stop blowing my unallocated income on scooter/moped parts and go do a trip like that!

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:22 pm

az_slynch wrote:I need to save up some vacation time, stop blowing my unallocated income on scooter/moped parts and go do a trip like that!

Do the 2014 Cannonball! It costs just as much, is every bit as difficult, but you have a lot more company to share the pain with.

rick71454 · Post by **rick71454** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:55 pm

Hello Buddyland:

My stator went bad because a mouse crawled up into my scooter and chewed the wiring in the stator. Maybe sounds funny, but that is what happened.
You might want to inspect your stator yourself and or have someone in the shop inspect it and then tell you what went wrong with your stator.

Rick71454

BootScootin'FireFighter · Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:48 pm

a few questions. I'm having the same apparent issues. Since this past weekend, I have a new battery, CDI, and spark plug. I pulled the stator and cleaned off the contacts. It was running great, yesterday. Today it was hard to start, and it's really difficult to kickstart it, but I did and made it in to work. It's on the trickle charge now.

1) I have access to a voltage meter at work. How do I place the prongs to test the pickup magnet? I don't have access to an impact wrench anymore, so I'm unable to pull the flywheel. Actually, I'm all packed up for my trip tomorrow.

2) Is there a vendor that sells the pickup magnet thingy seperate of the entire stator unit? I just emailed a local shop, hopefully they can help me, but if not...

3) If I am able to start it tomorrow morning, is there a possibility of it not making the trip? Will the long trip up there keep the battery juicing up as I go? I have a JR tender with me, so I will plug in overnight at my parents house.

The issue seems to be from when it was sitting outside overnight. It always stays outside, but I didn't have any issues getting around town yesterday. It ran like a champ. I had a little freak out this morning when I had to kickstart it.

Stormswift · Post by **Stormswift** » Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:35 am

rick71454 wrote:Hello Buddyland:

My stator went bad because a mouse crawled up into my scooter and chewed the wiring in the stator. Maybe sounds funny, but that is what happened.
You might want to inspect your stator yourself and or have someone in the shop inspect it and then tell you what went wrong with your stator.

Rick71454

There are 2 ways to deal with " pestus maximus" problem:
1. Go Elmer Fudd on the pest
2. Get one of these (unfortunately they are not sold on Amazon but your local craiglist should have plenty of listings):

Diablo · Post by **Diablo** » Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:39 pm

well at first I thought it was a carburetor or fuel problem.Tried seafoam thinking it was a clogged jet. It always started when cold but after a half hour it would die at idle at stop lights. It would start up again but want to die so I would keep the idle up with the throttle. Well folks this will be my 4th stator and it always acts the same.I put two on by a small shop close to me. They gave me to and both were bad from the get go.Then I took my scooter to a good shop in San Diego and they said yep a bad stator, and replaced it.This worked for two years, and now it's back doing it again. I'm afraid to ride it now until I get it fixed.I love my buddy 125 but this has been a major problem.
So if you think your carb is bad cuz it dies at idle.Its the stator!!!!!!!!

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:00 pm

Diablo wrote:well at first I thought it was a carburetor or fuel problem.Tried seafoam thinking it was a clogged jet. It always started when cold but after a half hour it would die at idle at stop lights. It would start up again but want to die so I would keep the idle up with the throttle. Well folks this will be my 4th stator and it always acts the same.I put two on by a small shop close to me. They gave me to and both were bad from the get go.Then I took my scooter to a good shop in San Diego and they said yep a bad stator, and replaced it.This worked for two years, and now it's back doing it again. I'm afraid to ride it now until I get it fixed.I love my buddy 125 but this has been a major problem.
So if you think your carb is bad cuz it dies at idle.Its the stator!!!!!!!!

I don't have any personal experience with the NCY stator but some folks have had better luck with them. Just a thought.

scootERIK · Post by **scootERIK** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 12:15 am

jrsjr wrote:I don't have any personal experience with the NCY stator but some folks have had better luck with them. Just a thought.

I highly recommend the NCY stator(0900-1007) mine has ~25,000 miles on it and still going strong, the OEMs failed at ~5k and ~3k.

Modern Buddy

Stator Failure

Stator Failure

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Re: Stator problems