Give up waiting and buy a 2T Stella or continue waiting??

[Animina]

Hi all, I am a new member of the world of scootering! This spring I got the scooter bug and signed up for motorcycle class in order to be ready for the 4T Stella. Like everyone else I have been waiting since April (I put a deposit down) and every month I call the dealership and they say...end of may...1st week of June...3 weeks after the 1st week of June. I understand it's not their fault, but I have lost patience and can see this situation dragging out until the summer is over. Bureaucracy is not known for speed! So I'm thinking of breaking down and settling for the 2T.

I am a novice, I literally sat on a scooter for the first time this April so I don't know much about it. I was told by the dealer when I initially went in that the 2T had some quirks which might be tough for a newbie to handle. Also the 2 year warranty is attractive. Any advice on how to proceed? I would hate to buy one and then the 4T's get release the following week, but I would also HATE to continue to wait and wait with no end in sight. How could I negotiate the price also since its the last years model? I've never purchased a new vehicle.

[tbonestone]

Well... 2t stellas are really fun... But be careful, and read the fine print on the warranty paperwork. It is 1yr or 5k miles whichever comes first on stellas. Stellas have their own warranty form separate from the modern selection of scooters

[bosco]

its not like there is no end in sight.

We are waiting on the government. Genuine has done all they can up till this point.

Blame the hippies who put in really strict emissions laws and the doorknobs who imported illegal SouthEastAsian bikes for the last few years finally getting busted for your wait time.

I say if you are patient, it will be rewarded with the bike you want.

With that said, the 2t stella is pretty badass and If I could legally get them in CA, Id be able to sell them all day long.

oh well.

[BrooktownGeezer]

its not like there is no end in sight.

We are waiting on the government. Genuine has done all they can up till this point.

No, it's not like there is no end in sight, but it's not a slam dunk either. If the EPA finds that LML substituted any parts for what was submitted in the original report, it could be a l-o-n-g wait.

Or they could be here in July. I kinda think that's the point of the frustration....nobody knows.

[ericalm]

Why would you prefer the 4T to the 2T?

[Lostmycage]

There's also another solution, one that's particularly good for new riders. Get a second hand scooter (any make as long as it's in decent repair and cheap). If it's got some physical imperfections, all the better. Use that to ride and get the feel for on. If/when you drop it, you can take great relief in knowing that it isn't your much awaited for Stella that's all scratched up and bruised.

I'm completely serious. I think everyone should learn on a beater... you know, one that's been checked over for true frame, good breaks, and sound mechanically.

But as far as missing out on good riding weather... you missed Spring by a large margin and Fall is still a good three months away, four if you count the "perfect weather" portion. You're just missing out on the muggy mid-year. It was 102 and humid today... I didn't touch my scoot, lol. Don't feel too bad, there's always a sunnier side and a stormier side to every situation.

[deck99]

Animina,
I went with a new 2T this spring and love it. I also saved over $1,000 buying the two stroke over the 4 stroke. I love it.

deck99

[Animina]

I was thinking about the new Stella because it has a better warranty and I was told it would be easier for a novice rider to handle. Other than that it would be aesthetics...I want the creme/tan combo, it's so clean and classy.

[ericalm]

I was thinking about the new Stella because it has a better warranty and I was told it would be easier for a novice rider to handle. Other than that it would be aesthetics...I want the creme/tan combo, it's so clean and classy.

That's what I'm riding!

As far as handling, there's probably little difference. If you're a new rider, I don't think one is any easier than the other.

One of the big points in my in-the-works review of the 4T is that it is still very much a STELLA. As far as riding and operation go, it's no different than the 2T.

[jmkjr72]

I was thinking about the new Stella because it has a better warranty and I was told it would be easier for a novice rider to handle. Other than that it would be aesthetics...I want the creme/tan combo, it's so clean and classy.

That's what I'm riding!

As far as handling, there's probably little difference. If you're a new rider, I don't think one is any easier than the other.

One of the big points in my in-the-works review of the 4T is that it is still very much a STELLA. As far as riding and operation go, it's no different than the 2T.

do you still get those oppps wheelies when you first take off with the 4 stroke that you get with the 2 stroke

[ericalm]

do you still get those oppps wheelies when you first take off with the 4 stroke that you get with the 2 stroke

I've actually only wheelied the 4T! Just once, and not on purpose. Eventually, I'll be able to do it on purpose. I think.

[dwayneed]

The lastest Scoot! review states thay lost about 20 mph on hills with the 4T, my 2T is pretty strong on hills. I would say that torque will be a difference on a 2T which is generally desirable. I do love the creme color though!

[ScootLemont]

I wanted a 2T before they were all gone
(I am just a 2T kind of guy)
Depending on how many of the 2T's are left in a given market, some dealers are selling new 08 & 09 2Ts for $1,000 less than 4Ts
I would think that could give some people reason to think about a 2009 2T

[despurvoa]

Here is my new 2-Stroke Scooter! 14 miles, and all of them except 5, put on by me (the dealer does a run through and inspection and so they got the first 5 in).
Anywho, it's not the 4-Stroke, but I really wanted to make the most out of the relatively short driving season in Milwaukee! 2-Stroke or 4-Stoke Genuine Stella; how can we lose either way, right?

I'm pretty happy, and although it was my first experience with a shifty manual, I really enjoyed it! I look forward to many miles o' fun!
I hope that those that continue to wait will get their scooters very, VERY soon, and look forward to hearing your reviews of those fine 4-Stroke babies!!!

All my best!

David

[jasondavis48108]

Here is my new 2-Stroke Scooter! 14 miles, and all of them except 5, put on by me (the dealer does a run through and inspection and so they got the first 5 in).
Anywho, it's not the 4-Stroke, but I really wanted to make the most out of the relatively short driving season in Milwaukee! 2-Stroke or 4-Stoke Genuine Stella; how can we lose either way, right?

I'm pretty happy, and although it was my first experience with a shifty manual, I really enjoyed it! I look forward to many miles o' fun!
I hope that those that continue to wait will get their scooters very, VERY soon, and look forward to hearing your reviews of those fine 4-Stroke babies!!!

All my best!

David

I personally like the 2T Stellas better. they are way easier to work on and from what I've read the modification optential is higher & cheaper on a 2T. I also really like the black although I must say the creme 4T looks really nice as well. I think we'll just have to wait and see if the reliability is higher enough to make it worth buying the 4T instead of the 2T. As for me, I just hope to see more used 2T Stellas for sale around here.

[bdonay]

I wish I had the option to buy a 2T out here in California, would have had one a long time ago.

[despurvoa]

My wife really wanted the creme. I think that was a great color idea by Genuine, and really does conjure up ideas of nostalgia. I think if I had to go with the 2-T black is pretty nice too, and I hear that at least in the near term, they won't be making them in black anymore either.
As long as it's a Stella, I guess we're all happy!

[illnoise]

I'd take the 2T over the 4T anyday.

While the fuel economy and emissions aspects of the 4T are nice, and the engine's quieter, (and you can buy it in CA, of course) you've gotta remember that the 2T Stella design has 30+ years of spare parts, accessories, performance gear, and know-how behind it via the Vespa PX. Plus, it's just a simpler design. It may require a bit more attention, but it's easier to work on, whether you or a mechanic is doing the service.

And fuel economy is diminishing returns, obviously higher mpg is better, but you're saving less and less money per mile:

http://2strokebuzz.com/2008/06/22/more-mpg-math

[Horace Albumin]

Dealer in Atlanta has several brand new 2T Stella 2009 with chrome package included (crash bars, racks etc.) for only $2700+ tax no add on fees or other stuff

[JoshWED]

I'd take the 2T over the 4T anyday.

While the fuel economy and emissions aspects of the 4T are nice, and the engine's quieter, (and you can buy it in CA, of course) you've gotta remember that the 2T Stella design has 30+ years of spare parts, accessories, performance gear, and know-how behind it via the Vespa PX. Plus, it's just a simpler design. It may require a bit more attention, but it's easier to work on, whether you or a mechanic is doing the service.

And fuel economy is diminishing returns, obviously higher mpg is better, but you're saving less and less money per mile:

http://2strokebuzz.com/2008/06/22/more-mpg-math

The louder engine of the 2T is what I consider the upside for mucking up the environment!

[ericalm]

I've been putting off writing a review of the 4T but will have one soon. I'm hoping it will help people decide whether they should wait.

I'm also hoping to ride a 2T so I can compare them.

[EvilTweety]

I'm going to wait it out... What's another 6 months to a year...

[Lovelandstella]

(Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:06 pm)... If the EPA finds that LML substituted any parts for what was submitted in the original report, it could be a l-o-n-g wait...

interersting foresight.

[JunkyardDog]

Why wait? The 2 stroke is way better than the 4 stroke, and right now you can get a great deal on one. Why buy a fake when you can get the real thing? Jerry.

[ericalm]

Why wait? The 2 stroke is way better than the 4 stroke, and right now you can get a great deal on one. Why buy a fake when you can get the real thing? Jerry.

Better how?

The only negative difference as far as I can tell so far: 4t is slower on hills. :shrug:

[Lovelandstella]

Why wait? The 2 stroke is way better than the 4 stroke, and right now you can get a great deal on one. Why buy a fake when you can get the real thing? Jerry.

Better how?

The only negative difference as far as I can tell so far: 4t is slower on hills. :shrug:

My 2t is dangerously slow on hills. course at 300 ODO miles I'm still taking it easy.
a loss of 10 mph can get you hit from behind. 15 can get you maimed and I imagine 20 can get me killed. so now I don't ride on hills at night- not untill its broken in. [rule]. so like another couple weeks ...

[ericalm]

Why wait? The 2 stroke is way better than the 4 stroke, and right now you can get a great deal on one. Why buy a fake when you can get the real thing? Jerry.

Better how?

The only negative difference as far as I can tell so far: 4t is slower on hills. :shrug:

My 2t is dangerously slow on hills. course at 300 ODO miles I'm still taking it easy.
a loss of 10 mph can get you hit from behind. 15 can get you maimed and I imagine 20 can get me killed. so now I don't ride on hills at night- not untill its broken in. [rule]. so like another couple weeks ...

Pretty much all shifty scooters suffer on hills. I was on a ride with some Vespa and Lambretta 150s and 200s and we all slowed on hills. This is one of the problems the shifty crowd has with doing big rides with moderns. The shifters need to haul ass as they approach a hill then lose a lot of speed going up. So do they go in the front or the back of the pack?

I'm hoping a pipe will help with this. Maybe some gearing tweaks…?

Meanwhile, it's only been a real problem on one hill, which is probably a 10-12% grade or some such. It's STEEP. I started from a red light and eventually had to wave a car around me.

[BrooktownGeezer]

I'm hoping a pipe will help with this. Maybe some gearing tweaks…?

Meanwhile, it's only been a real problem on one hill, which is probably a 10-12% grade or some such. It's STEEP. I started from a red light and eventually had to wave a car around me.

Slowing on hills is just part of the experience with low-tech and low displacement scoots. You have to plan for the inevitable slow down, and if that means pulling over to let impatient people by, I have no problem with that.

I had a Vespa ET4 that slowed to 45 at WOT going up a hill between my office and home. Since that particular road has no shoulder or turning lane, it honestly was dangerous. I found a different route home that worked just fine for the ET. I later bought a GT200 which took the same hill with no problem.

My 1970 Sprint with a P series motor has a pipe on it and a 177 kit, and I'd rather take the slow road home when I ride it than try to flog it into doing 50 mph up the grade.

Enjoy the 40 year old technology for what it is!

[Lovelandstella]

...and if that means pulling over to let impatient people by, I have no problem with that...

Me neither! whatver gets the crazies in 'front' of me and no longer 'behind' me... I'm for it!

[JunkyardDog]

IMO, the 2T is the real deal. Plus I've always been a 2 stroke guy, I love 2 stroke scooters, dirt bikes, and even mopeds. 4 strokes just don't have enough character for me (unless it is a Harley). I also ride a Vino 125 4T, and while any scooter is more fun than a car, the Vino is drop dead boring compared to the Stella. At least the 4T Stella will have manual shift.

I am also upset about the demise of 2T bikes of all kinds. I'm 51, and am probably what you would call a hippie. I have a ponytail, and wear a peace sign around my neck. I am also an environmentalist, EXCEPT when it comes to vehicle emissions. So don't blame me for any of those EPA issues. I have bigger environmental issues to be concerned about. During the past 30 years, I have seen the destruction of my state (AZ) by developers and govment roadbuilders on an almost unbelievable scale. It will never be the way it was. But air pollution is very temporary. Quit making it, and it goes away. We would not have an air pollution problem here if the states population wasn't 10 times what it was 30 years ago. (yes, I'm an AZ native). So the developers and govment created that too.

But back to scooters, I will probably leave my 2T Stella stock, except for removal of the cat con, and will probably convert it to premix at some point (the mechanical issue with it turned out to be a problem with the oil injection, it was getting WAY too much oil). Since it will not be a daily rider, premixing will not be a real problem.


As for small displacement scooters on hills, ALL small displacement scooters suffer on hills, but those with CVTs are much worse. I can't even ride my Vino 125 in the mountains, it lacks a low enough fear range to prevent lugging the engine at slow speeds. I had a 125cc 4T motorcycle with manual shift, and it was very slow climbing mountains. But at least with the manual transmission, I could keep the engine running in the powerband.


My main concern with the 4T Stella is build quality. A 4T engine is a lot more complicated than a 2T, and if things go wrong, it will not be nearly as easy for a mechanically inclined owner to fix it. I also see the 2T as more of a hobby bike than the 4T. I have nothing against 4T engines, in fact I drag race one that runs in the low 12s (in a car). And I am about to buy another 4T scooter. (with a CVT) I'm just happy I got one of the last 150cc 2 stroke scooters likely to ever be available in this country again.

If you are a true scooter enthusiast, and can still get a new 2T Stella, I would grab it while you can. Jerry.

[Silver Streak]

[mattgordon]

well said....