NBR: kiddo is hacking into parental controls

Discussion of the Genuine Buddy, Hooligan, Black Jack and other topics, both scooter related and not

Moderator: Modern Buddy Staff

User avatar
skully93
Member
Posts: 2597
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2011 3:54 pm
Location: Denver CO

Post by skully93 »

I dunno. I'd give him one more chance, and then say "if you do that again, you will only be allowed to use the computer in front of me for homework for a while".

Then follow up on it.
Image
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

We are out of chances at this point. I went and deleted his account. He will use computer in front of us or none at all. As far as I can figure it out he went into downloaded portion of the program in program files and from there straight to the Minecraft site. The only thing he could not turn off is notifications by Norton every time he did it.
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
User avatar
skully93
Member
Posts: 2597
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2011 3:54 pm
Location: Denver CO

Post by skully93 »

well I applaud his ingenuity, but disobeying Mom constantly...you gotta stop that, otherwise he'll end up in IT like me...
Image
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

skully93 wrote:well I applaud his ingenuity, but disobeying Mom constantly...you gotta stop that, otherwise he'll end up in IT like me...
ROFL...if only.
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
Lokky
Member
Posts: 763
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:52 am
Location: Richmond VA

Post by Lokky »

I am seriously puzzled by why him playing minecraft is bad.

You mentioned that he isn't getting around his time restraints for using the computer, merely that he's playing a rather constructive game, it's basically like the legos of this generation!
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

Lokky wrote:I am seriously puzzled by why him playing minecraft is bad.

You mentioned that he isn't getting around his time restraints for using the computer, merely that he's playing a rather constructive game, it's basically like the legos of this generation!
Minecraft according to some parents is addictive kind of a game so that is kind of a concern.

But here is the latest (and this one is priceless).Since I took out restore points I explained to my son what " Restore to factory settings" means and that any settings that get wiped out mommy will not be re-settingn(little things like network, Internet, network printer, his proggies). So last night he slithered downstaired looking major guilty. Guess what he did? Yep. He did back up "files" so now his computer has 3 partitions. I barly managed to find them. Had to reset permissions to access them but at least trip videos and pictures are still there. The network and Internet settings however are gone. I am still laughing about that. He totally locked himself out of Internet. From now on it will be superwised access only. I think he is getting the crush lesson on do's and dont's when it comes to computers :twisted:
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
User avatar
Syd
Member
Posts: 4686
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:41 am
Location: Tempe

Post by Syd »

Awesome lesson! Now force him to learn how to fix it!
The majority is always sane - Nessus
Lokky
Member
Posts: 763
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:52 am
Location: Richmond VA

Post by Lokky »

Stormswift wrote: Minecraft according to some parents is addictive kind of a game so that is kind of a concern.
eh, when I grew up the internet was thought to be addictive and dangerous, nowadays it's seen as an indispensable tool.

To me barring a kid from doing something he is passionate about, with appropriate time limits, is only going to cause unnecessary conflict between the kid and the parents.
TVB

Post by TVB »

Lokky wrote:To me barring a kid from doing something he is passionate about, with appropriate time limits, is only going to cause unnecessary conflict between the kid and the parents.
I'm inclined to agree, but it sounds like this is no longer about Minecraft. Now it's about overt defiance of authority... and it's better that he learn how badly that turns out now, rather than later when the consequences are harsher.
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

TVB wrote:
Lokky wrote:To me barring a kid from doing something he is passionate about, with appropriate time limits, is only going to cause unnecessary conflict between the kid and the parents.
I'm inclined to agree, but it sounds like this is no longer about Minecraft. Now it's about overt defiance of authority... and it's better that he learn how badly that turns out now, rather than later when the consequences are harsher.
+1...It is a control issue and this kind of defiance is unacceptable. He does need to learn about consequences and this was kind of good because he is the one who made a mess of his computer all on his own. Right now he asked nicely if he can be allowed to re-install his LEGO Mindstorms program.
Last edited by Stormswift on Tue Oct 30, 2012 4:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
paige
Member
Posts: 271
Joined: Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:05 pm

Post by paige »

IIRC,
Minecraft is available as a standalone game that can be played without Internet access.
User avatar
z20k
Member
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Austin, TX

Post by z20k »

paige wrote:IIRC,
Minecraft is available as a standalone game that can be played without Internet access.
You can play it offline but it requires a net connection to validate your account each time.
Oh, so they have internet on computers now!
Lokky
Member
Posts: 763
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:52 am
Location: Richmond VA

Post by Lokky »

Stormswift wrote:
TVB wrote:
Lokky wrote:To me barring a kid from doing something he is passionate about, with appropriate time limits, is only going to cause unnecessary conflict between the kid and the parents.
I'm inclined to agree, but it sounds like this is no longer about Minecraft. Now it's about overt defiance of authority... and it's better that he learn how badly that turns out now, rather than later when the consequences are harsher.
+1...It is a control issue and this kind of defiance is unacceptable. He does need to learn about consequences and this was kind of good because he is the one who made a mess of his computer all on his own. Right now he asked nicely if he can be allowed to re-install his LEGO Mindcraft program.
I understand it's a control issue, but as an outside observer it seems that both parties are at fault, your kid for trying to go around your restrictions (which is what kids do really) and you for imposing a restriction on something that isn't harmful to begin with.

Now I'm not trying to tell you how to parent, I want nothing to do with kids myself, but it just seems like this is a completely avoidable conflict.
User avatar
LunaP
Member
Posts: 1152
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Richmond, VA

Post by LunaP »

Stormswift wrote:
TVB wrote:
Lokky wrote:To me barring a kid from doing something he is passionate about, with appropriate time limits, is only going to cause unnecessary conflict between the kid and the parents.
I'm inclined to agree, but it sounds like this is no longer about Minecraft. Now it's about overt defiance of authority... and it's better that he learn how badly that turns out now, rather than later when the consequences are harsher.
+1...It is a control issue and this kind of defiance is unacceptable. He does need to learn about consequences and this was kind of good because he is the one who made a mess of his computer all on his own. Right now he asked nicely if he can be allowed to re-install his LEGO Mindcraft program.
The ENTIRE middle of this thread I had no idea why I was continuing to read, haha. I am not tech-savvy AT ALL, and don't really understand any of the IT lingo here.

But this is what it seems to me: it seems that your 11 year old is incredibly smart and needs challenges to stay motivated. Obviously computers is what does it for him. I seems to me that this whole thing kind of inadvertently turned into a game of cat-and-mouse, at least for him... I think maybe these things he was doing to circumvent you may have been less outright acts of defiance, and more a product of him viewing your new security protocols as a challenge and taking them on. Which if you think about it, is pretty freaking amazing that he was able to get around them all... because to be frank, Stomrswift, you yourself seem to be substantially more knowledgeable than the average Joe or Jane (me).

But regardless of whether he should be allowed to play Minecraft, and under what conditions (which, btw guys, that's HER decision, and NOT the reason she started this thread)... your child does need to realize that he is also outright defying you and that needs to stop. So, I applaud your decision to go old-school and pull the plug, unless somebody is watching and/or he needs it for school.

If he wants to look a bewbs, give him magazines. If he wants to talk to his friends, he can use the phone or text. He can also play other video games. And maybe he should eventually treat you, and himself, like an adult and present to you why he wants/thinks he should be able/thinks playing Minecraft would be stimulating for him, and you can consider based on that. But unless he treats the situation, and you both like adults, instead of doing this behind-the-back stuff, you have every right to treat him like the 11 year old, misbehaving child that he is.
paige wrote:IIRC,
Minecraft is available as a standalone game that can be played without Internet access.
This. There is ZERO need for a child to act like that over not being able to play a single video game. It's a fricking video game. I don't care what video game it is. If he wants badly to play the actual game, it can be played offline. If that is still not okay or causes problems, they still make these amazing things called Legos that he can play with IRL. This is kind of why I think circumventing Stormswifts security maneuvers became the fun thing to do... I could be all or partially wrong, though. My point is that Minecraft =/= necessary for life. And there are other cool games out there.

Sounds like a great opportunity for old-school gaming education to me. Whip out Ocarina of Time. :lol:
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

Apparently it is a cat and mouse game. He " borrowed wi-fi flash drive from our old computer and tried to use that to connect his computer to the Internet......The only reason he did not succeed is because he did not find the other flash drive with connection software which was prudently hiddenby me. I am estimating it takes him less than 48 hours to find another back door.
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
User avatar
spr0k3t
Member
Posts: 426
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:14 am
Location: Kansas City

Post by spr0k3t »

This thread is fun. It reminds me of when I was young... only back then it was a 120baud modem and phone cables that were hidden.
User avatar
PeteH
Member
Posts: 2281
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:32 pm
Location: 3603mi SE of Dutch Harbor

Post by PeteH »

Perhaps he needs to be shown a ball peen hammer and reminded of consequences. Carrots are fine and well, but sometimes the subject needs to be reminded of the stick.
Feel da rhythm! Feel da rhyme! Get on up! It's Buddy Time!
User avatar
az_slynch
Member
Posts: 1806
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 4:56 pm
Location: Tucson, AZ

Post by az_slynch »

PeteH wrote:Perhaps he needs to be shown a ball peen hammer and reminded of consequences. Carrots are fine and well, but sometimes the subject needs to be reminded of the stick.
Thinking of a scene from Payback involving Mel Gibson? :shock:
At what point does a hobby become an addiction? I'm uncertain, but after the twelfth scooter, it sorta feels like the latter...

Seriously...I've lost count...

Seven mopeds ...that's still manageable...
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

He is now on " within my site only" when he allowed to access Internet on our netbook to do research. He already figured out " null modem" connection :cry: between netbook and computer that connects via wi-fi USB drive (which is now under lock and key). Good thing the old box is bare bones and does not have TCP IP Protocol installed......not that I remember the significance after 10 years when I last wiped it clean............ I thought IT stuff was a thing of the past for me. I am too firmly entranched in Social work now but with my kiddo.......Time to dust off my Networking essentials book, methinks. Prolly should find a refresher course on line..
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
TVB

Post by TVB »

IT plus Social Work sounds like just the skillset you need here. :)
User avatar
Syd
Member
Posts: 4686
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:41 am
Location: Tempe

Post by Syd »

From IT to Social Work? Talk about two thankless professions!
The majority is always sane - Nessus
User avatar
PeteH
Member
Posts: 2281
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:32 pm
Location: 3603mi SE of Dutch Harbor

Post by PeteH »

Null modem-ed to the clunker?

Crafty little beggar.

Seems like the cat-and-mouse is getting old on your part, and it's only escalating. I went briefly down this road with my oldest years ago. Confiscation of the offending hardware plus confiscation of his video games led to a shift in behavior, and the problem didn't resurface. He was Not Happy with his enforced period of supervised computing (at mom/dad's convenience), but he got over it. He also knew I was monitoring.

You don't want to be dealing with this later, when such things as automobiles and alcohol might be involved.

You're the one with the social-work training, but IMHO it's time to apply the stick, or the ball-peen hammer, if you will. He needs to realize that this ain't no democracy, and it's at best a benevolent dictatorship. Boundaries mean things. Best of luck to you.
Feel da rhythm! Feel da rhyme! Get on up! It's Buddy Time!
Lokky
Member
Posts: 763
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:52 am
Location: Richmond VA

Post by Lokky »

Stormswift wrote:He is now on " within my site only" when he allowed to access Internet on our netbook to do research. He already figured out " null modem" connection :cry: between netbook and computer that connects via wi-fi USB drive (which is now under lock and key). Good thing the old box is bare bones and does not have TCP IP Protocol installed......not that I remember the significance after 10 years when I last wiped it clean............ I thought IT stuff was a thing of the past for me. I am too firmly entranched in Social work now but with my kiddo.......Time to dust off my Networking essentials book, methinks. Prolly should find a refresher course on line..
TCP-IP protocols are saved within the OS files and can be reinstalled in two clicks if one knows where to look, sounds like he'll figure that one out sooner or later
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

Lokky wrote:
Stormswift wrote:He is now on " within my site only" when he allowed to access Internet on our netbook to do research. He already figured out " null modem" connection :cry: between netbook and computer that connects via wi-fi USB drive (which is now under lock and key). Good thing the old box is bare bones and does not have TCP IP Protocol installed......not that I remember the significance after 10 years when I last wiped it clean............ I thought IT stuff was a thing of the past for me. I am too firmly entranched in Social work now but with my kiddo.......Time to dust off my Networking essentials book, methinks. Prolly should find a refresher course on line..
TCP-IP protocols are saved within the OS files and can be reinstalled in two clicks if one knows where to look, sounds like he'll figure that one out sooner or later
Win 32 or something like that? Sorry, I am beyound rusty
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

TVB wrote:IT plus Social Work sounds like just the skillset you need here. :)
LOL, wish it all combined into a " supermom" skills but with today's generation...
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
Lokky
Member
Posts: 763
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 6:52 am
Location: Richmond VA

Post by Lokky »

Stormswift wrote:

Win 32 or something like that? Sorry, I am beyound rusty

all you have to do is go into the ethernet adaptor settings, there is a list of installed protocols and a button that allows to install new ones, by clicking it you are given a list of available protocols to install and TCP-IP protocols are found there, there is no way to remove them as far as I know unless you figure out which file in win32 it is.
User avatar
Syd
Member
Posts: 4686
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:41 am
Location: Tempe

Post by Syd »

Lokky wrote:
Stormswift wrote:

Win 32 or something like that? Sorry, I am beyound rusty

all you have to do is go into the ethernet adaptor settings, there is a list of installed protocols and a button that allows to install new ones, by clicking it you are given a list of available protocols to install and TCP-IP protocols are found there, there is no way to remove them as far as I know unless you figure out which file in win32 it is.
Easier yet, find Device Manager, uninstall the network adapter and reboot. The interface and protocols will automagically reinstall.
The majority is always sane - Nessus
User avatar
spr0k3t
Member
Posts: 426
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:14 am
Location: Kansas City

Post by spr0k3t »

Sometimes that doesn't work Syd... I've found removing the TCP stack completely and rebuilding after reboot works without problems 99% of the time.
User avatar
pugbuddy
Member
Posts: 1659
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:31 am
Location: Tulsa OK

Post by pugbuddy »

eh, when I grew up the internet was thought to be addictive and dangerous, nowadays it's seen as an indispensable tool.
Nah, not so much. And yeah, it's still dangerous and definitely addictive. Tangent over! :wink:
Image
Image
Robert Wayne Henderson (May 16, 1932 - July 28, 2009).
User avatar
Lotrat
Member
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 5:35 am
Location: Vista, CA

Post by Lotrat »

It's free and is on all my kids machines.

http://www1.k9webprotection.com/
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

Yah...me again....We are done messing with Vista and now into Windows 8. I had 3 sets of Parental controls: router time lock, Win8 parental and Norton. What tipped us off is that he was too smug and I did not get Windows Parental control weekly report email which lists where he's been and what he was up to. So I checked. He changed his account to regular user from child and thus deactivated parental controls. I have my suspicion that this happened when he had access to my mom's computer and she was logged in under my account (Admin). I will need to create her own account as regular user for her. I guess . I am so tired of this :evil:
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
User avatar
ender07
Member
Posts: 192
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 9:17 pm
Location: Madison, WI

Post by ender07 »

I was kinda this kid when I was younger but my parents didn't know until I told them about my hacking skills when I was in my early twenties. I would say short of adding a BIOS password, encrytpting the hard drive with special software, locking down the admin account with a difficult password, or physically secure the desktop itself...you are just going to have to monitor it when he is on it.

The easiest solution would be to move the computer out of his room to a more public space and make every account password protected with a password you set so only you can log him in. That way you know when he is on the computer and after he logs off you can change the password every so often to see if he trips up.

Just my 2 cents.


(I work in IT so if you need some help PM me.)
Roughhouse 50 - custom green paint job, Prima exhaust pipe, 5G rollers, 1000 RPM contra spring, 2000 RPM clutch pillow springs, 95 carb jet, UNI pod air filter, debadged, delobstered, PIAA Super Plasma performance headlight
User avatar
Witch
Member
Posts: 253
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:42 pm
Contact:

Post by Witch »

For the brief time I lived at my uncle's house in high school, I was on my computer constantly as an escape (my own machine in my room). When he decided I should actually get some sleep at night, he simply took away the keyboard. Of course I knew I could use the accessibility options for a visual keyboard with the mouse, but not if I couldn't even get myself to that point without a physical one first. As an extra precaution, he came back for the power cable as well.

Stopped me for a good 48 hours, until I borrowed spares from a friend at school. 8) I've never been anywhere near a knowledge level to be considered a hacker, but I have been known to be fairly resourceful at times.

I agree with the statements going along the lines of physically restricting access at this point. Doesn't sound like it's going to happen just going any kind of software/password route.
User avatar
Syd
Member
Posts: 4686
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:41 am
Location: Tempe

Post by Syd »

Get a Live CD of a Linux variant without remastering/burning capabilities. If nothing else he will learn valuable Linux administration skills.
The majority is always sane - Nessus
User avatar
skully93
Member
Posts: 2597
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2011 3:54 pm
Location: Denver CO

Post by skully93 »

wow, I wouldn't have thought about the null-modem thing.

Again, he's smart! Best to channel it, but I think a full week of ass-busting chores is in order too :P
Image
iMoses

Post by iMoses »

IMOO -
Sounds as if the both the parent and the child like this game.

Why not just put boundaries and if he crosses them take away his computer for a few days. The penalty for not obeying the parent.

My thinking is that the kid will think that all rules are meant to be broken and no consequences will ever have to be paid.

I'm old and cranky…. so I will say…. "in my day"….
Stormswift
Member
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2009 12:22 am
Location: Maryland

Post by Stormswift »

I deleted his user account from the tablet. The time restriction is still holding on desktop. No access to tablet at this time. Last evening he was pissed off, sulking in his room with his WW II B29 bomber book ( don' t ask). He heard me and grandma laughing downstairs & came to investigate arriving just in time to hear the judge giving oppinion on the spoiled brat lawsuit against parents followed by a mom who sent her uncontrollable teen daugher to live with her father in .....#Siberia, topped by Texas dad who pulverized his daughter's laptop with a.45 caliber. My dear child gave me the " look" and appears to have formed an opinion that my rules are reasonable compared to some others.
PS. Win RT tablet was a reward for being on deans list. I wanted him to have Office for school work, etc. He is still in all GT classes, math is his best subject. I know this is not the worst that he could be doing but it is driving me nuts. I actually a while back changed his desktop BIOS password . Wish I can remember what it was .
I am not a scooter snob.
I am a scooter connoisseur
User avatar
DoubleD
Member
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 3:33 pm
Location: Florida

Post by DoubleD »

JBenjimin wrote:Our kids (10 and 12) have full unrestricted access to the internet, but their computers, are in the family room, the busiest room in the house. We used to run an ISP back in the days of dial up and that was the recommendation of the Center for Missing and Exploited Children. That is what we recommended to our customers and it is what we practice. Do they visit inappropriate sites when we are not home, maybe, but we trust them to do the right thing and have told them that. But then again we are the rebel parents that keep our kids out the Race to the Top state testing, write comments all over the code of conduct where it is ridiculous, and otherwise question nanny state policies and rules. We're Libertarians and it shows.
We need more rebel parents like you. Both of our kids had their own computers but were not allowed to have them in their rooms. Both were desktops set up in the family room. They used them in middle school, high school, and now off in college, they have their laptops. Neither was ever a problem as expectations were made clear. As for the Race to the Top, we picked up a copy of "The Neurotic Parent's Guide to College Admissions" and had great laughs. One of our kids in particular noted how many in her high school fit the pattern perfectly - parents and kids. Sad but true. One of our son's friends when asked if he wanted to go bike riding said, "I wish I had time to just play and have fun." Kid was in the 9th grade.
Post Reply