Modern Buddy

When I drive a car I am always very careful about dimming the lights when I encounter another car, so I've been doing that on my scooter as well. But...I've been wondering, is it really necessary? How bright is the light anyway and by dimming it I reduce my visibility to others plus my own ability to see the road ahead is significantly lessened. So I wonder if it is okay to run at night with the head light always on high. What are your thoughts?

I don't think it's bright enough to affect another driver unless it's shining directly into their rearview mirror. However, at the same time, if it makes you more visible then all the better, right?

Also, our scooters use halogen bulbs so it's not as glaring as the xenons that you see on most vehicles now. I would love to upgrade my scooter headlight to xenons if I could!

You should not have your headlight on high at night (at least when you encounter others). Many riders (myself included) do have theirs on high during the day though, to help with visibility.

I also seem to recall reading somewhere that if you install a headlight modulator that it is illegal to use it after dusk. I know that is not what your question was, but it's kind of related, so I thought I'd add it.

Please dim your headlight for oncoming traffic. Believe me...it's bright enough to shine in the eyes of oncoming drivers. You may think it's making you more visible, but in practice you're creating a risk for yourself: if your high beam is shining in my eyes, it makes it much more difficult for me to make out where the lane is, which puts me at risk for crossing the line into your lane.

Assuming your headlight is properly adjusted, that high beam is brighter than you may think. If you don't believe me, park your scooter in front of your car, turn the high beam on, and go sit in the car. I saw spots for a WHILE.

Ooh...I'm a noob. Ignore me.

Ms_Kady wrote:Ooh...I'm a noob. Ignore me.

We all start somewhere. That said, upgrading your headlight is something many people recommend. (I'm lazy and have yet to get around to it.) Check out the tech section for more info on the headlight upgrade. I think it's a Sylvania Silverstar...or something. I'm being lazy tonight and not cross-referencing that before hitting the post button.

Cheshire wrote:

Ms_Kady wrote:Ooh...I'm a noob. Ignore me.

We all start somewhere. That said, upgrading your headlight is something many people recommend. (I'm lazy and have yet to get around to it.) Check out the tech section for more info on the headlight upgrade. I think it's a Sylvania Silverstar...or something. I'm being lazy tonight and not cross-referencing that before hitting the post button.

I'll look that up. Thank you!

Eff cagers, they never see me anyway, so I ride with my brights at night all the time!

most of the streets I ride at night have no street lights or very few. I'm bright all the time. We've only got 1 light (on the Buddy) such that I don't think it's doing anything but saying "THERE'S A CYCLE OVER HERE, YO!"

Not once has a car flashed me to dim it so I'll keep it high unless there's fog or enough street lights

My low beams on my Blur are pathetic! So I ride highbeams a 100% of the time. It actually makes visability normal and I have never been high-beamed back for it.

Low beam on the Rattler is a little dash/taglightbulb,,, totaly useless around other light (can not see the road) I have adjusted the highbeam as if a lowbeam.... One thing for sure you can easly outrun the light you have to see to drive safely... Far as headon traffic and the 18 watt Rattler highbeam im sorry but iv got to see the road...

Another thing about the Rattlers headlight is that unlike the Buddy it does not mounted on the handlebar... In a turn you do not get to really see into a turn... The side span of the headlight is about 4feet on the side... I ride my TGB (same headlight style not handlebar mounted) at night it spans farther to the side and the light is 35watts much brighter and floods the road with light high or low beam...

I run high beams all the time unless someone oncoming flashes theirs at me. Then I dim for them. One other exception is when I am behind someone at a traffice light and the bright light is obviously hitting them and their inside rearview mirror. Then I dim them. Mostly for compact pickups and smaller sedans.
This morning I was behind a older Nissan compact pickup truck and could tell my bright was blinding him. I dimmed and he held up his hand and waved while looking in his rearview mirror. He was happy and his response made me feel good.

Just as an example. We had a group ride durring the summer. There was a Big Ruckus that rode with it's high beams on in the day. At one point he got behind me and his headlight was so bright in my mirrors I couldn't see anything. I had to drop back and ask him to dim them.

I know the Buddy's headlight isn't the brightest, but it may still be brighter than you think!

If your headlight is aimed properly, it's not only inconsiderate to ride with high beams on (especially at night) in traffic, it's not doing you any favors. It's putting yourself at a serious risk by causing a driver to be distracted by their impaired vision. Not something you want an oncoming cager to be dealing with.

Again, this depends a lot on whether your headlight is aimed properly. Many are not when they are prepped by the dealer and that causes a lot of us to think the headlight is inadequate on low. I've posted aiming instructions below. But as DennisD's post above suggests, a Buddy's single light on high can be blinding for a driver, even in daylight. So, riding with them all the time has the potential to make you even more invisible to a cager.

Here is a very compelling post that definitely made me rethink my high beam usage.


Motorcycle Headlight Aiming
Getting a correctly aimed headlight is straightforward. You need to make a couple of measurements and then aim the light at a flat wall, as follows:

With the bike on its wheels and you astride, have a helper measure the distance from the floor to the center of the headlight lens.

Pick a flat wall where you can locate the bike so the headlight is 17 feet from the wall. Place a horizontal mark on the wall two (2) inches lower than the height of the center of the headlight.

The headlight beam (on low beam) should be relatively flat on the top, and may rise rather sharply at the right edge. Adjust the headlight vertically so that the flat top of the beam is just up to that
line (marked two inches down at 17 feet).

I'm used to riding (and driving the cage) on 2-lane roads. In that situation, when something blinds people (whiteout, bright lights, whatever) there is a natural tendency to drift toward the center of the road, to keep from running off the road. So they drift into the lane of oncoming traffic. Just something to think about.

I am on high beams 100% of the time. It might have something to do with the fact that my city light isn't working...

DennisD wrote:I run high beams all the time unless someone oncoming flashes theirs at me. Then I dim for them. One other exception is when I am behind someone at a traffice light and the bright light is obviously hitting them and their inside rearview mirror. Then I dim them. Mostly for compact pickups and smaller sedans.
This morning I was behind a older Nissan compact pickup truck and could tell my bright was blinding him. I dimmed and he held up his hand and waved while looking in his rearview mirror. He was happy and his response made me feel good.

+1.
More interested in being clearly seen than worried about 'annoying' someone!
Plus all of the newer cars no longer use the older sealed beam headlights, and their halogen or HID headlights now glow so brilliantly it's difficult to tell sometimes whether anyone's brights are on or not!
So I gladly take full advantage of that..!
So I'm not a 'nice' guy... But I do like my self, my whole self, in one piece!

Drumwoulf wrote:More interested in being clearly seen than worried about 'annoying' someone!

You might change your mind when you've "annoyed" somebody into accidentally slamming into you because they couldn't see properly with your light in their eyes. Temporarily blinding other drivers does not actually make you more visible.

Cheshire wrote:

Ms_Kady wrote:Ooh...I'm a noob. Ignore me.

We all start somewhere. That said, upgrading your headlight is something many people recommend. (I'm lazy and have yet to get around to it.) Check out the tech section for more info on the headlight upgrade. I think it's a Sylvania Silverstar...or something. I'm being lazy tonight and not cross-referencing that before hitting the post button.

Cheshire,

Another bulb option is one that Skootz Kabootz and others here at MB suggested to me that I have used the past three months:
PIAA PowerSport Bulb HS1 Super Plasma GT-X
It requires the same power to run as the Buddy 150cc stock bulb yet gives off almost twice the wattage.

The light itself is a beautiful bluish purple light low beam and then an extreme bright white high beam. If I routinely used the high beam against oncoming traffic I could/would cause an accident. The low beam itself is very bright and distinctive.

This new bulb is a significant improvement.

I actually got pulled over by a not-so-happy cop for leaving my headlight on high beam. Apparently, this is illegal in Ohio.

I plead ignorance and I guess the fact that my license still says "novice" on it, he let me off with a very clear warning. He let me know that my headlight is plenty bright and the risk of blinding someone piloting a vehicle large enough to leave me a small grease spot on the side of the road is not worth the additional attention that it might gain.

Also, remember that some folks have a hard time when going from darkness to bright light and are more susceptible to being blinded by a passing vehicle with their brights left on. It might not be a problem for some of you, but you don't know about that person driving down the road towards you.

-v

ok i `m not a wal-martian but get some fog runners ( 50watt) ( they are clear not the red ones) and buckle them down on your front rack ( if you have one) and if you don`t get one.
then it has a switch you can line up center to easily flips them on w/out distraction.
they are under $20 and a great investment for safety. you can also run them low on the front bars.,, a lil trip to the hardware store and some rubber gasket material will keep any chaffing off.
,, then hit the hi-beams!! and ride like the bad scooter you are
IMHO
p.s and if you need your hand held they are "labled "platinum Burners"
....round chrome"

TVB wrote:

Drumwoulf wrote:More interested in being clearly seen than worried about 'annoying' someone!

You might change your mind when you've "annoyed" somebody into accidentally slamming into you because they couldn't see properly with your light in their eyes. Temporarily blinding other drivers does not actually make you more visible.

Nice Urban Legend...
Perhaps a possibility, but I never heard of it happening much..
But I definitely have heard and read a zillion tiimes, "Oh I'm so sorry,
I just didn't see him/her there (on that bike..) when I pulled out, turned left, changed lanes, etc, etc, etc!"

Hey, ride the way you want. Just don't think you're gonna discourage my methods of conspicuousness!
(And try not to ram any bikes with their brights on, okay?)

Drumwoulf wrote:

TVB wrote:

Drumwoulf wrote:More interested in being clearly seen than worried about 'annoying' someone!

You might change your mind when you've "annoyed" somebody into accidentally slamming into you because they couldn't see properly with your light in their eyes. Temporarily blinding other drivers does not actually make you more visible.

Nice Urban Legend...


Hey, ride the way you want. Just don't think you're gonna discourage my methods of conspicuousness!
:

Urban legend? Please do some more research on this. Read the thread I linked up above in my last post. Read what that cop told Vic. No, riding with your high beam at night does not guarantee someone is going to hit you. Yes, the possibility of blinding an oncoming driver and making it more likely they will plow into you or misjudge your distance is very real and far from an urban legend.

We're discussing safety and trying to keep as many scooterists alive as possible. No one is here to "discourage your methods of conspicuousness" but please don't dismiss potentially dangerous fact as urban legend, either.

Kaos wrote:We had a group ride durring the summer. There was a Big Ruckus that rode with it's high beams on in the day. At one point he got behind me and his headlight was so bright in my mirrors I couldn't see anything. I had to drop back and ask him to dim them.

I was riding with my buds at the beach, my neighbor(s) on Ruckii and Mrs. on her Met - ALL of their lights are noticably brighter than any of my scoots. Mrs' Buddy has the Silverstars and they're brighter than stock but I'm thinking the stock Honda headlights are brighter than the Silverstars. If we ride after dark I always drop in between 2 of them or tailgun if it's just 2 of us. With a Ruckus behind me I cant even see the wash of light from my TGB lamps - all I see is my shadow. I dont think the Ruckus has a hi/lo setting.

As to the question at hand I always run highbeams - if I get flashed by an oncoming car I will dim until I pass but under normal conditions I ride'em high. My Blur beams are pretty weak and the Burgman is pathetic on low after dark.

Drumwoulf wrote:Perhaps a possibility, but I never heard of it happening much..

Maybe the reason you don't hear of it happening much is because most people don't go around with their brights on all the time. Of course it's your safety to risk as you see fit, but temporarily blinding other drivers at night affects their safety too.

I run high during the day and regular at night unless there's no oncoming traffic.

It has less to do with brightness than focus. High beams tend to run 5w higher on most vehicles (same wattage hi/low on the stock Buddy: no difference). It's the angle of the light that makes the difference. High beams are further back in the reflector housing which changes where the light is focused. The rear filament points up higher.

Part of the reason for difficulty in distance gaging with high beams on is there there's an expectation from other driver's to have the low beam burning. When the light is pointed higher than the oncoming cars are expecting, it does two things.

1- It blinds them which makes judging not only distance but all other spacial relations, such as which lane they're in, difficult.

2- It gives the impression that you're farther away. This second part has a lot to do with the many subconscious calculations that happen while driving and the expectations that we have from years of driving.

This is even more difficult when riding at night because there's no sun, so on coming drivers pupils are dilated. Shining the light in their eyes will cause some degree of temporary blindness. This is usually a bad thing when they're heading at you at the same speed as you're heading at them (90mph if you were standing still, assuming both vehicles are traveling at 45 mph) and they're most likely already distracted talking or texting. My guess is they're already taxing their eyesight enough trying to see those tiny letters in the dark.

During the day, a headlight, hi or low, doesn't affect oncoming traffic nearly as much because the other driver's pupils are constricted already, you know- cause of sunlight and all that. Hi beam during the day can help with being more noticeable.

That being said, the main reason I burn my hi beams during the day is that it's less wear on the low beam's (or the main night beam that I use) filament. This means my expensive as hell PIAA lamp will last longer. At $45 a pop, I want it to last for a REALLY long time.

You guys do what you want, but if you've got your high beams on and you're driving towards me, don't be surprised if I "signal" you to turn them down. You can't very well expect cagers to be respectful of you if you're not going to be respectful of them. I think that's part of the whole "sharing the road" concept.

Here's a nickel, I'd like my $.03 change back please.

Lostmycage wrote:I run high during the day and regular at night unless there's no oncoming traffic.

It has less to do with brightness than focus. High beams tend to run 5w higher on most vehicles (same wattage hi/low on the stock Buddy: no difference). It's the angle of the light that makes the difference. High beams are further back in the reflector housing which changes where the light is focused. The rear filament points up higher.

Part of the reason for difficulty in distance gaging with high beams on is there there's an expectation from other driver's to have the low beam burning. When the light is pointed higher than the oncoming cars are expecting, it does two things.

1- It blinds them which makes judging not only distance but all other spacial relations, such as which lane they're in, difficult.

2- It gives the impression that you're farther away. This second part has a lot to do with the many subconscious calculations that happen while driving and the expectations that we have from years of driving.

This is even more difficult when riding at night because there's no sun, so on coming drivers pupils are dilated. Shining the light in their eyes will cause some degree of temporary blindness. This is usually a bad thing when they're heading at you at the same speed as you're heading at them (90mph if you were standing still, assuming both vehicles are traveling at 45 mph) and they're most likely already distracted talking or texting. My guess is they're already taxing their eyesight enough trying to see those tiny letters in the dark.

During the day, a headlight, hi or low, doesn't affect oncoming traffic nearly as much because the other driver's pupils are constricted already, you know- cause of sunlight and all that. Hi beam during the day can help with being more noticeable.

That being said, the main reason I burn my hi beams during the day is that it's less wear on the low beam's (or the main night beam that I use) filament. This means my expensive as hell PIAA lamp will last longer. At $45 a pop, I want it to last for a REALLY long time.

You guys do what you want, but if you've got your high beams on and you're driving towards me, don't be surprised if I "signal" you to turn them down. You can't very well expect cagers to be respectful of you if you're not going to be respectful of them. I think that's part of the whole "sharing the road" concept.

Here's a nickel, I'd like my $.03 change back please.

That was a very interesting post. What you wrote about day and night riding considerations make sense. I found your insights and thoughts about riding with high and low beams impressive (technically and from the human perspective). As you probably know, I have the same bulb as you and I too want it to last as long as possible.

Thank you.

Lostmycage wrote:I run high during the day and regular at night unless there's no oncoming traffic.

There are some instances when I'll turn high beams at night—mainly if I'm out in the canyons when there's little traffic. I'll of course switch to low when traffic is oncoming. However, it not only helps me see what's ahead, but also lets cars know there's a vehicle around a curve.

I will also sometimes flash my high beam at night if on a dark street when a car pulls up to a cross street.

When riding in groups, I ride with my low beam on, even during the day.

Vic wrote:Also, remember that some folks have a hard time when going from darkness to bright light and are more susceptible to being blinded by a passing vehicle with their brights left on. It might not be a problem for some of you, but you don't know about that person driving down the road towards you.

I'm one of those types. I have excellent night vision and eyes that dilate to the point the iris all but disappears. High beams not only blind me for several seconds, but hurt because it's so much light so quickly.

Being in the mountains and almost every road being a curve or hill, I usually have my high beam on to spot animals in the woods/brush if there's no cars in front of me (in any capacity). Lately, after some trial and error experimentation, I've had great success with dimming my high beam a split second after an oncoming car's headlights come into view. Except for the very rare instance, the other car will kill their high beams a second after I kill mine, and both of us get to keep our vision.
I can see a car's headlights usually a good 5+ seconds before they actually round the corner or crest the hill, but I found that if I killed my high beam before the car saw me they usually didn't turn their brights off.

If a car can notice that I turned off my high beam from 2 hills over (happens regularly) I think it's safe to say our headlights are plenty bright...yes? No?

Another good reason for high beams at night in my neighborhood; all the $%#@#& deer! High beams give me more of a chance of seeing them and maybe also catching their eye-gleams at the sides of the roads, then low ones ever could..!

Plus IMO the 2007 Buddy's headlight is neither very large nor very bright, even on high beam with the improved 55/65W Silverstar I use in it! I almost never get anyone blinking their headlights at me, and I sorta think that if it annoyed them all that much they really would do that, no?! So I think all this talk here about the unsafe blinding of people with my lil' Buddys hi beam is really a bit of worry-wart overkill..!

As I was driving home this evening, in the dark I was watching the guy in front of me and I realised that he also was dimming his lights as soon as he saw oncoming traffic which caused them to respond in the same way.

Seems like that is a great way to let an oncoming vehicle know that you are getting closer (they don't have two diverging points of light to help them gauge your approach) and also to get their attention. That flicker from high to low beams could help to gain their attention. I would venture far more effectively, and safely, than blinding them.

If your headlights are so dim that you can't function safely with them then an upgrade should be considered.

My Sym has a ton of candlepower on the front of it: foglights, excellent lowbeams and highbeams that rival my Volkswagen. I can also move the switch in between the high and low beams and BOTH lights will stay lit. I figure I am about as bright as a Christmas Tree moving down the road. I leave the fog lights on all the time because it creates a triangle shape to help oncoming traffic gauge my approach and they are aimed low and there is no risk of blinding anyone.

By the way, the cop pulled me over on my Buddy, I have no doubt I would have been ticketed if I was on the Sym.

I am looking into some of the add on lighting options that are available, but the Buddy's electrical system is not the strongest point of the bike There are options for upgrades, mods and such, but I don't trust my particular scooter's electrical system at all.

I would suggest that folks that are wanting to add to their night time visability, instead of running the risk of blinding oncoming vehicles by running brights all the time, look into adding lights or utilizing the deadlights already on the scooter-or both.

Cheers,
-v

Vic wrote:As I was driving home this evening, in the dark I was watching the guy in front of me and I realised that he also was dimming his lights as soon as he saw oncoming traffic which caused them to respond in the same way.

Seems like that is a great way to let an oncoming vehicle know that you are getting closer (they don't have two diverging points of light to help them gauge your approach) and also to get their attention. That flicker from high to low beams could help to gain their attention. I would venture far more effectively, and safely, than blinding them.
[snipped]
Cheers,
-v

Vic, I think that's what I was trying to say earlier with the whole expectation and assumption bit. Thanks for such a clear example.

,,why is this like alot of topics here all over the place?
1) you want to see what is in front of you
2) place some aux/lights on the road level not up in the air
3) just do it, the factory headlamps are ok, but i like my road in front of me
lit up.
,,ride like a pro and stop being seen as a wussy on a scooter!!!!!!!!!